[dominiquer60]

Thanks Andy,

The first one that I looked at was The Cultivator from Albany, NY 1958, fascinating. I love reading old literature and realizing how similar our times are. Page 28 speaks of houses for winter vegetable production with the mention of harvesting Kale all winter from such houses, the concept has not changed just the materials that the houses are now made of.

Thanks for these links!

[dominiquer60]

Amen to that, and thank you Andy, Tim and Donn for traveling so far, it would not have been the same without you all.

[dominiquer60]

I like how by everyone donating (at least a tiny bit) to register we will be able to sort out the hundreds of spammers and hopefully a makeover will solve the problems we’ve been having with real people not being able to register successfully.

[dominiquer60]

Wild dogs hate electric fence. I have had great luck keeping them from chickens with only an electric fence. A friend who has a sheep farm with sometimes over 300 head has never lost a lamb that she knows of in 20+ years. Her philosophy is simple, good fences make good neighbors. She has a hot 4 or 5 strand perimeter fence around all pasture areas and cross fences with electronet. She permits hunters to shot deer, but not coyotes. She believes that the local dog population knows their place on the correct side of the fences and have no problematic habits. If hunters kill them a pushy coyote may take on her farm as new territory and become a problem.

Anna mule should keep them at bay.

[dominiquer60]

I have a 5′ Schipshe Cultimulcher and I Love it. It cannot handle very heavy residue, but I didn’t expect it to. I use it to smooth a seed bed and also to work in cover crop seeds. The 5′ is a nice size for a team. There is a nice range of adjustment, but no matter how much I try I can’t seem to adjust it very deep, but I generally use it lightly anyway.

[dominiquer60]

I think I am good. My strawberries are on the highpoint at the edge of the vegetable field and the heifer pasture is below that, the feeding/holding and manure storage area is 200′- 250′ away. Water always runs down hill from the strawberries to all other locations. between the strawberries and the heifers is a wide grass lane way that acts as a buffer and harvest lane, it is a 2′ drop from the laneway into the heifer pasture. Thankfully the water in the heifer pasture never runs towards the veg because of this berm and lane way.

Thanks for your help Fogish!

[dominiquer60]

It is tough enough just trying to farm, let alone getting regs straight, so I treat all manure no matter how long or how many times mixed as raw manure and wait the 120 days till harvest. That way if a turning is forgotten or not written down I am within the guidelines no matter what happens. I generally apply manure in the fall to a cover crop or to establish a cover crop, I haven’t wanted to risk it.

One thing that I have not been able to find yet is how close livestock can be adjacent to a vegetable field. The National Leafy Greens Act was encouraging CA farmers to take out all hedgerows to discourage birds from flying over, I was expecting something like that in this monstrosity. We have a heifer pasture 25′ from my strawberries, it is a good fence and they never get out, but I wonder what the feds think of that.

[dominiquer60]

Fogish,

Your insight has been helpful, I am just having a hard time understanding what is up or down and what is set and what they are still taking comments on. If they can’t dazzle us with brilliance, they will drown us with documents.

I have always used the 120 days before harvest when applying raw manure, I have never had access to proper compost.

I am going to try to get into a GAP workshop at some point just so that I can keep up to date with what I should be doing if I am not already, or so I can learn how to justify my actions to the feds.

[dominiquer60]

I don’t know if it will make you feel any better, but I did the same thing last month while helping Sam clean up a sugarbush, but I was lucky that I just twisted my ankle and the wood missed me. I had already brought a few poles through but my foot found a hollow spot in the ground and I went down, the lines escaped my hands, the mare hesitated at my whoa, but when she felt the lines loose she just kept going, blazed her own exit trail behind the ice cream stand, safely crossed the state highway and stopped when she made it back to the barn. She is what we refer to as a union horse, when that end of the work day whistle blows in her head she is done with work, I am the 4th person she has done this to in some way or another.

Some one had unhitched her by the time I caught up with her and told me it was no use and that I would not “win.” But I had a job to finish, so I hitched back up and twitched a couple more sticks out of the sugar bush. Sam finished when my ankle said I was done and she tried to walk off on him, but failed when she hit the end of the lines tied to a sapling while he was bucking up a log. She is a good horse, but certainly thinks nothing of taking her own initiative now and then. I think that we ended up “winning” just because we got the job done in the end.

I am glad that you and JD are reasonably well after that incident, they certainly keep us on our toes don’t they. I hope that your knee heals fast and our “union horses” do better at following safety standards in the work place, even if the whistle blows 🙂

[dominiquer60]

Maybe we will be forced to follow EU rules and start plowing like this, http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=lQ_us0UFf_U. I want to see how he cultivates raised beds like this with his horse.

[dominiquer60]

Agreed. Never thought about the herd thing much, mine have been in various living situations, but now that I think of it, It was probably a really good thing that when I brought them home they lived in 2 calf hutches in a small pasture. They were loose and together during the day and tied up separate at night. When we had a real winter in 2010 I finally had to bring them into the barn, but after 3 months of training and them being separate I never really had too much of a problem with them being herd bound.

Get them out and away from the herd and if you don’t tie them up regularly it is good for them to get used to it ASAP, away from the herd.

[dominiquer60]

I don’t find the bird poop thing ridiculous, enforcing it yes, but I have always been of mind that if there is feces on something, it is best not to sell it. Now if there were bird droppings on the out leaf of a broccoli plant I would cut the head, but dead center on a head of lettuce, I will leave it to feed the soil instead of a human.

Andy, I did think about how to interpret the “segregated path,” such language may mean the wheel tracks between rows of veg, but if that was the case I picture them making us use diapers like a carriage horse in the city.

The real problem I have with all this is that trying to read all this stuff is like shopping for a mattress, all of these documents look similar and say similar things but every time I turn around I can’t find the one that I want or was just reading.

I thought that I read that we have to wait 9 months from an untreated manure application until we can harvest, it used to be 120 days was the recommendation, but now I can’t find where it states that.

One thing that I thought would be interesting to bring up again it the Equicert program. They are GAP certifying horse powered farms for the plain clothes community so that they can sell at auction and wholesale.

http://equicert.biz/

I am going to see if he may be able to write something for our Spring newsletter.

[dominiquer60]

If you don’t want a tractor this is the next best option and more than likely cheaper.

Here it is in action at our 2011 NEAPFD event. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DThHZ9rXkQ0

Sam had 4 abreast on it because that is what they asked him to bring, but 2 well conditioned horses could us this, but not all day. Sam recommends being very diligent about raking small even rows or it will clog. There were some bale tension and traction problems with this rig that day, so having wheel weights or extra bodies around can aid in gaining traction. They find that it works better with JD model balers because of the way the fly wheel is positioned.

[dominiquer60]

Another thing that I thought of does not have to do with walking next to your steer, but does have to do with leadership and personal space. When I feed my animals (steers, horses, even dogs) I am the one in charge. I make my dogs sit and wait until they are released with an “OK.” I make the horses walk out of the barnyard to the feeder in front of me, then I make sure that they are not crowding me before I pour the grain out. With the steers, no matter inside or out, I make them yield the right of way to me, even if that means just taking one step back from where I place their pile of hay along the stone wall in the pasture. I do this because, A) It is safer for me with the big animals and it enforces everyday that I am the lead mare/cow, B) It give me room to work, C) With the dogs, I don’t share food well, if I leave a sandwich in my truck, it better be there when I am ready to eat it, I own all food unless I tell them it’s ok to eat. I am a firm believer in the 5 second rule and I’ll be damned if I am going to fight a dog for something of the floor, so every time something edible is on the floor they look to me for permission even if it is their own food dish.

This is just an personal space issue, so look at how they interact with you any time you are around and make sure they are moving out of your space when you need it.

Best of Luck,

Erika

[dominiquer60]

Luke you bring up a great topic. Though I don’t log or work with a company of your type, the same problem can apply to a farming situation. I have one field that was hay for 15 years and beside some dock and chic weed, there are not much for weed seeds in that field. The other field that I work was corn for many years and has pigweed, gypsum weed, lambsquarter, foxtail, and velvet leaf. I am planning on washing/cleaning equipment when I am done in the “dirty” field, but foolishly I haven’t thought about the horses feet.

For me it should be easy enough with a garden hose, but out on a job site your task becomes more difficult. Shaving the long hair off the horses legs could be helpful, but flushing the feet would be a big plus. At another farm we had a 5 gallon insulated water cooler that we hooked a small sprayer pump up to and we put ice water in it to keep vegetables cool and moist at the farmers market. If you could rig something up like that it may be of aid in the warmer months of the year. Just a thought.

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