[Donn Hewes]

Hi Rod, I think it is great to figure out ways to get our horses involved in these little tasks as they can learn from the waiting and the noises of loading and unloading, and turning, etc. I was thinking that It just means an extra trip with the saw and without the horses to make the piles.

Then I read your post. Be careful about tieing to something they can move. You might be surprised what they can move with their head if they want to. Especially to leave them tied for more than a few minutes or while you are running a chain saw. Not saying it won’t work, but the potential for a problem is there if the situation is just right. If it is the right sled and the right horse it might be fine, just something to consider. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Like anyone who has made more than a few bales of hay, I have a bunch of little sayings and slogans that remind me of my own learning. One I like to say to some one who is just starting out is “Hay is like fire wood – No matter how you split it, it will still burn”. Meaning – you will learn as you go and most of what you bale will be good hay. You will have some bales that are loose, and some that are heavy. Just keep learning from each field you cut, rake, and bale.

Have fun. My wife never thinks I am having any fun at all. I am growling at the weather, whining about the equipment, and threatening the horses. I am stiff and sore and tired. When I am done I tell her it is one of the funnest things I do all year. I enjoy the challenge of it, and of doing well. Greased the haybine yesterday!

[Donn Hewes]

I have the luxury of having an old bus seat on one of my fore carts. I all ways look forward to raking hay from there. never had much trouble with seeing where I was going or turning radius. I wish I had an umbrella!

[Donn Hewes]

Thanks for all the great comments. It has given me something to think about. As to plowing and planting, it might well be a good idea but it isn’t really for me. As we feed our hay to dairy sheep, don’t really want an alfalfa pasture. Not really looking to sell hay.

I still think the sub soiler has potential but not something to rush into. The problem is when you want to test an idea you don’t want to spend too much money doing it. I think I can get my hands on an old trailer plow with bad bottoms but all the moving parts work. I could try a home made shank or two on that for little cost. I won’t try for supper depth at first, maybe 8 – 12″ range. That is probably as far as I will get with a trailer plow but is also as far as I might want. Probably have to wait till fall or winter now. Will keep you posted.

Thanks again. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Yes, I think you are right the ideal angle has the drive shaft parrallel to the ground. But I agree with what Neal said, I have run these mowers a few inches high or low with out any problems. I think it is quite common to run them a little low. Neal really hit everything I would say, check to make sure you can adjust the knive angle parrallel to the ground plus a point or two up or down. I usually am parrallel but sometimes I tip it down a little for lodged grass or short windy conditions. I also thought that the evener might be a little close to the heel. Good horses will tolerate the occasional heel hitting the evener, but I always try to fix it as it is a hazard that isn’t needed. Once they try to kick it will you are going down hill it is a little late to wish they had a longer tongue.

If there is enough room for the team I would use it. If not, a longer tongue is actually correcting for the tongue too high. For the same reason that halflingers on a short pole can get the right angle also. Halflingers on a mower for a larger team will often carry the tongue too low; but I have never seen a problem by doing that. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Lots of great stuff in this thread. From hand made to haybine. I mentioned earlier about watching the neighbors. There are some potential pitfalls to watching a farmer with a couple tractors and several wagons. Some one mentioned earlier that the hay can change quickly on the right day (this is very true). Tractor farmers love this, they will run out at four or five, or even six and decide to bale a few wagon loads and stick them in the shed. I definitely don’t have that luxury. If I want to bale I prefer to rake in the morning come out from a long lunch, check the hay, and start hooking up again one pm. if possible, four at the latest. I just need to adjust my planing in the days prior. When I think I will bale effects when I will tedd and rake. Carl, yes Carl Russell, mentioned tedding twice in one day. This will make hay dry fast (remember that is the goal) but I seldom feel I can afford the effort. Each of us factors in all our own variables and has our own way of doing it. That is just one of the things that makes it interesting / challenging. A hand full of sisal twine helps start the wood stove each winter morning. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

What would Carl Do? No, not Carl Russel; Carl my neighbor who makes over 100 acres a year of good small square bales. With horses I can’t always do exactly what he does, and I do try to minimize the number of trips over the field, but you can learn a lot from your neighbors. I can look across the hill and see if he is mowing.

Learn to be flexible. One year tedding may be the most important thing in the world. While your neighbors are all tedding twice you are luck to do it once. The next year you may go for weeks with out tedding a row of hay. Soil moisture is a BIG factor. In a wet year you not only have to dodge the rain drops, but the continues attack of the soil moisture as well, crops dry slower and take more effort.

Don’t try and do to much at one time. 5 or 6 acres is enough for me. if it gets rained on I can use it for bedding hay, and better luck next week. On the other hand if the weather really looks prime I will try to mow two days in a row. I like to mow after 11 most day unless it is going to be really hot out. This lets the grasses sugar acumulate, and lets the plants dry before cutting. On day two I can tedd in the morning and mow hay in the afternoon. Day three is the toughy. Hopefully one person is tedding the second days mowed while someone else is raking the first mowed. Than we work together to bale hay in the afternoon. Next day finish raking and baling.

For farming with horses I really hate to rake the same hay on two different days. I just want to rake it, then if it needs more drying leave it. Come back the next day and bale it with out raking again. Many tractor farmers would never do that. It works fine as long as the soil conditions are dry enough and the hay has in fact dried.

Good luck, I will get all the equipment out this week a check the tires, lube and oil! Donn

Feel free to ask specific questions, but it is such a slowly learned craft with a bit a black magic thrown in, it is hard to tell.

[Donn Hewes]

Hi George, I have used one for two or three years and I like it a lot. Easy to use and easy to maintain. Wish I had another. Having said that I also use one of the old horse drawn “new idea” rakes that both teds and rakes. While riding on that rake is a lot less fun there are a few circumstances were I think the more aggressive tedder works better. One is rained on hay, and the other is a rained on windrow. I tend to mow in the afternoon and ted the next morning, and that tedder works great for that. Won’t be long now. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Hello Hoss, I hope you find someone that is using one of those machines. In case you don’t I can give you a wild guess. Most mower eveners are not that wide, like 34″ + or -. With a 28″ single tree your single trees will not be digging into the tongue all the time. The size of the evener is to keep the horses inside the mowed area; too wide and they are walking in the unmowed grass. Make sure your neck yoke length matches your evener. On the MD mowers there is a rod that goes from the mower head to the bracket were the evener is attached. This helps complete the triangulation that supports the head. Anything like that on your Avery? Good luck, Donn

[Donn Hewes]

They will get a chance to break a sweat this summer. There are many jobs I do were my animals never get tired. But it is amazing how much I get done, and I never have to slow down. The rest breaks are few and short. More horses makes light work!

JL, it sounds like fun, I hope we see some pictures. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Hello Carl, Andre, and everyone, JL, Glad to hear you hooked up the four. It is funny how some people just like working with one or two which is great; and other’s just keep wanting to add more horses! Even though I enjoy a team as much as the next person, I must confess to a thrill from even three or four.

I would love to work with Andre and Sam on multiple hitches. I am at my best on animals abreast. I can show at least three different ways to drive them. I have almost no experience with the tandem hitch, ( doubled my knowledge last year! Thanks again) but I am a good hand.

Carl, if you are taking notes already, the other thing I would like to do is bring my mower with the dolly wheel. I would like to work with someone with another mower and two teams. One with D ring harness and one with out. it would make a good illustration for folks about how the two harnesses are different and how they should fit, and how they work. Also makes a good mower demo as you find interesting things to talk about on each machine. There was a women there last year with a mower and a nice team of horses. I wish I could remember her name. I would love to work with someone like that. Time to feed sheep. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

You can see the wheel in the pictures under the tread “mowing with mules and horses”. But it is not a close up. There are different types of wheels. Some mowers came with tongue trucks (two wheels) as original equipment. I have never tried one of these. My wheel is an Amish version That I first saw in Indiana. Since found a couple of makers in PA. About 175$. I will work on a better picture and the names of places that sell them. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

geoff, Here is my two cents. Some horses pick this up very quickly and are eager to show what they can do. Most horses and mules would rather go forward or back than move side ways. The trick is to not let the eager horse rush the event. Focus on useing both lines to turn to the side. The first one tells them which way to go ( same as the voice command). The other hand can limit how fast they turn. Make a goal of not touching anyone with the tongue, not all ways easy to do, but the right idea. Instead of doing a 180 make them stop and collect themselves if need be. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

L stone, The further you get from the basic gee, haw, and whoa, the more variations you will find amongst different teamsters. I use “come gee” and “come haw” I usually precede it with the name of the animal on the side I am going to. Sounds like “Ethel, come gee” or “George come haw”. I try to limit how I use “come gee” and “come haw” for true side passes. I use “move over” or “get over” when they are tied up.

I try not to use good old gee and haw much. Most turns in a field or wood don’t require any words. I save it for when I want a little more or sharper. It is almost like a preparatory command that lets everyone know where we are going. If there is a stump in front of us and I want everyone going around it the same way. Often the less said the better. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Hi Scott, the bar it’s self is a long peice of steel with holes in it; and probably is fine unless it is bent. Can be straightened I believe. Like a pair of siccors, the cutting action comes from two parts. The knife moves back and forth and is contected to the pitman stick. Consider the condition of your stick while you are at it. The knives can be sharpened, or some or all of the teeth can be replaced, or a new knife can be bought. I think 75 to 100$ depending on length. I like to buy the new knives, althought I have sharpened them and repaired them too. For knives I would call BW. Mcnair

The knife comes out of the mower by disconnecting it from the pitman stick and sliding it out toward the mower (under). This may come easy or it may be tight. Once it is out you see the other half of the cutting action. There is a row of guards, or rock guards, so named because when you hit a rock they lift your bar over it with out the knife touching. Each guard has a ledger plate riveted to it. This is a little plate with serrated teeth that the knife slides over. In old and worn out guards these plates might not even be visible. In others you will see where the serrations used to be but they will be mostly gone. These serrations need to be sharp for the mower to work right. In some cases it is worth while to change ledger plates and save the guard and in others it is easier to replace the whole guard and plate.

Guards can also be bought from BW Mcnair, there are several other options. A john Deere or New Holland dealer may well have guards that fit. Some even look identical. Make sure the whole spacing ( three inches I believe) is the same, as you can find some JD guards that are about 3 1/4 “; a real drag.

There are hold downs and and shims ever foot or so. These are critical to making the knife run free but also hold it close to the ledger plate. Old hold downs wear a way and are bent so they continue to to there job. New ones would be nice if your were putting a lot of new parts together.

Finally, I would recommend two resources; Lynn Miller’s mowing Machine book will help a lot; and BW Mcnair. These guys know these machines and can send you what ever you need. Look the up in the Equipment dealer listing or SFJ ads.

Fun Machines to work on, and really fun to operate when they are working well. In the thread “mowing with horses and mules” that is a number seven that I just added the dolly wheel to. That would be a great feature for halflingers unless you already have D ring harness. Don’t get me wrong, Halflingers will mow with a number seven, they will just mow farther and easier if you take some of the tongue weight away. Good luck, Donn

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