[Donn Hewes]

Most folks out here have never seen or heard of the pop up loader you are talking about. I have never seen one in NY. I was impressed with the one I saw in Wa. You might not make the wagons full, though.

[Donn Hewes]

Good question, I think that is were you would test the efficiency of your PTO cart versus a motor on the baler. On flat ground I have seen teams of two, pull a baler no problem. I think two would pull a PTO cart and baler, as well. The only place I have ever used mine without a wagon, is on the one truly hilly spot on my farm. When I made that hill one end of a six acre field the horses could pull the wagon up the hill (short end), but when I mowed a small two acre piece with the same hill it was up one side and down the other. I just left the wagon off and baled it to the ground. easy with four and probably could have done fine with three but I would have been pushing a team of two to bale up and down that hill. This is were I believe a motor right on the baler might be slightly more efficient, but maybe not.

Baling on the ground is all right,but I do think it has to do with how many bales you hope to make in a year (or a day). Too many bales and it is just much more efficient to put them on the wagon while you make them.

[Donn Hewes]

Hello, I use a PTO forecart, but my guess is a motor on the baler it’s self would be slightly more efficient. Both set ups are routinely pulled by four animals with a hay wagon. If a baler is the only PTO implement you want to use a motor on the baler is a lot less expensive (I would guess) than a motorized cart. On the other hand if you wanted to run a haybine or other PTO equipment then a cart may be cheaper and more versatile.

You can see pictures of mowing and baling with four or five head on my farm on my web album.

[Donn Hewes]

Joshua, Got any pictures of her?

[Donn Hewes]

Nice Job Jenn, I too was thinking of other responses yesterday, but you beat us to it! Last year I bought a mare with the exact same face. Often when someone asks “what can my horse pull?” we are really talking about what can I do? keep it up. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Ed, they look great in those photos! I know how satisfying that is, working to make them go well, and then enjoying good working animals. There are a couple of tricks for the first time you hook them to a mower. If you have questions be sure to ask. Nice work! Donn

[Donn Hewes]

“follow you through the jungle” is a great metaphor for the relationship / leadership we are looking for. Hopefully they will go calmly and quietly!

[Donn Hewes]

Just out of curiosity, and it is really none of my business; but I would be interested to know more of the history of you with this horse. How old is he? How long have you had him? What training or experience was he said to have had before you got him? What level of experience do you bring to this horse project? I could be completely wrong but, “frightened in the barn yard” sounds fishy to me. By that I mean I believe it is the situation he is uncomfortable with. Are you able to be calm and relaxed while the horse is exhibiting the snorting and shying? That can be hard to do, and the horse won’t be calm and relaxed if you aren’t.

In the past I spent a fair amount of time trying to figure out whether an animal was acting out of fear or just trying to assert it self. I felt that my response to those very different behaviors would be different. Today I feel that most of the time, most horses and mules mix the fear and assertive behavior very quickly. Like poor soup or brown paint. I really don’t expend any energy trying to figure out which it is. I pretty much treat them the same. I want the animal to be calm and relaxed and attentive.

Standing calm and relaxed is a horse’s natural state, but it can be hard for them when confronted with new situations. Being separated from other horses is an excellent example of that. The only draw back to a chain over the nose (and it will work) is can you use it with enough subtlety to convey the behavior you want with out adding a lot of energy to a situation that already has a fair bit.

[Donn Hewes]

Just to add a couple of thoughts.

I like a rope halter for certain initial training steps. Having said that, I agree with Jenn, Carl, and others, that it is not the particular piece of tack you choose but your ability to use it to gain and maintain the animals attention. Preferable with as low of an energy level as needed. Introduce new ideas as fast as the animal is ready, but all ways work slowly enough to keep the animal calm and relaxed.

George you mentioned round pens, and I agree they can be very useful. Like a rope halter they are not the be all and end all. We should distinguish their use into two different groups. The first use of a round pen is to gain the attention of an animal that is NOT paying attention to you. A round pen is not the only way to get the attention of this horse but it is a basic and effective one if you know how to use it. The point is you apply pressure to the animal and use the pen to push against and make them go forward. A round pen with two wires is not ideal for this initial training. Some of these animals will take a fair amount of pressure before you get the response you are looking for and the wires are not enough to push against. A solid round pen is prefered for this step in the training.

Part two. Having said that, I use use a single stand of wire as a round pen for lots of kinds of training. This is for animals that I have no problem getting their attention, but want to use a loose training method (the animal is free – not tied or attached or tethered) for further education. The wire makes it so they won’t walk away if I turn my back or let them take a break. I am a big fan of loose training to move on command, stop on command, harnessing, bridling, working on feet. I feel that their freedom develops some responsibility on their part for what they are learning and accepting. The trainer learns to use their skills and personality! to keep the animals attention rather than any tool. Many of these things can also be done loose in the yard with a lead rope. Even though your hand is not constantly on the lead rope it provides you with the ability to prevent them from walking away, and while it rests on their neck it reminds them that they are “with you”.

[Donn Hewes]

I think when you have the time frames that Carl does ( a few years), and the pigs and poultry and steers for assistance; returning these lands to productive pasture is not rocket science. I am working on a very similar project. I am piling the brush, ignoring the stumps, winter feeding horses, using pigs in the summer, and soon will have a nice place to put sheep on a hot summer day. Donn

PS. Had a fellow visit today, asked me “why my horses where kept in by a single hot wire that was only a foot of the ground?”. I think I said, “I have no idea!” Snow so deep I had to plow with a tractor. I hate that. – ugh!

[Donn Hewes]

A think tank should probably be breathable, but water proof. Flexible and able to with stand huge changes in temperature. Oh, I will just button it and get back in the hot tub!

[Donn Hewes]

I wanted photos too; unfortunately I just pulled them up the hill through heavy wet snow with no one to take a picture. The arch is really working good now. I can still see little tweaks, but it was easier to hook and unhook today and the bead in the center of the runner worked great. The arch is 4″ taller and I made it so the arch doesn’t tip over backward but may be just an inch past vertical. I made it so it only tips forward to about 45 degrees. Still need to put a seat on it. The butt log I cut was 16′. I probably pulled it close to a half mile, but I stopped three times.

[Donn Hewes]

My sympathies! I have a lot of good work waiting under the snow already! I just go start working somewhere else.

[Donn Hewes]

Wish I wasn’t going to the fire house, I would come over. Any chance you will be working with horses the following Saturday? Donn

[Donn Hewes]

here is a picture. While Connie was generous to lower her head, the hand placement above and below is what allows me, (and convinces them) to take a bit and bridle. The rope halter is around her neck, a loose reminder that she is constrained.

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