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Sabine, makes sense to me. I was responding to Geoff’s comment about a portable anchor.

George

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Geoff, my reprimand is a sharp tug on the lines followed by “hey” if there is a duet going one or just “Don” or “Jim” (whatever the case may be) if it is just one horse. The sharp tug, followed by full release should minimize the confusion around backing up which tends to be more sustained pressure (at least for me) when backing.

Regarding the portable anchor, anything I can pick-up and muscle around, the horses can (and then some) even with their heads. I want to know when I do tie my horses to something, they are not leaving it, no matter what.

George

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Over the course of 3 years of working my team they have gone from standing ok in most situations to excellent in all situations. There are still minor infractions at times which involve food (i.e. reaching for that hemlock branch or grass etc), but this is relatively rare and is met with a sharp reminder. Here is what has worked for me:

1. Make sure your horses are well fed before working them. If they still are reaching for grass, put a check on them. I agree with Sabine that horses should not be eating while harnessed.
2. Stop them in a variety of situations on a variety of different equipment and wait. If they move, reprimand. I gave a sharp tug on the lines with a low “hey”.
3. Get your horses sweaty and tired. They should be excited to stand. My first year haying I did fairly extensive repairs on equipment in the field with the horses waiting patiently. They relished the rest in work.
4. I use a retractable dog leash. As my horses began to stand better, I would load wood on a wagon, buck logs etc. by myself, and any infraction was met with a reprimand. At first they sensed I was away from the lines and were surprised with the reprimand that occurred from a distance.
5. I try not to tie my horses by their heads (I am the guy who was chained to the tree). I like to secure the cart to the tree. My horses learned to stand while I was felling trees while chained to a tree. One or two lurches in response to falling trees while my logging arch was secured to a tree and they stopped.
6. I don’t tolerate any bobbing, scratching, rubbing, etc. This is an invitation to a lost or caught bridle. Again, infractions are met with a reprimand. If my horses are doing a lot of this, I investigate to see if there is something making them uncomfortable.

Good luck.

George

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Carl:

Thanks for posting that. I met Claude at the first Animal Powered Field Days. I was just starting off with horses and he was happy to answer lots of questions. He is a wealth of knowledge and an extremely nice fellow.

George

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Mark:

I have both pants and chaps and hardly ever wear the pants. I find them hot in the summer and bulky in the winter. I like the chaps that wrap all the way around your calf.

George

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Scott, what do you plan on making? I was given a swivel / chain grab that I use for ground skidding that prevents the log from twisting the evener if it rolls. I would like to have a second one on-hand, but haven’t seen anything like it for sale. Looking at those swivels, I suppose you could cut off one end and weld a chain grab (not sure if this the correct term?) The one I use is a piece of steel plate that has a nice deep groove in it so you don’t lose your chain.

George

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@Ronnie Tucker 25373 wrote:

the wagon has a circle iron it is able to turn much shorter than a auto steer.we always use stay chains which take care of a lot of the tongue whip.the tongue chains are not tight accept to turn.all broke mules are broke to work with one line .it is not hard to teach. ronnie tucker

Ronnie:

Those are some impressive pictures. I don’t understand the difference between a “circle iron” and auto steer. In auto steer, is the pole attached to the front axle and steers it as the pole moves? What is a circle iron? What is “tongue whip”? How about “tongue chains”? Lastly what is the advantage to working a mule/horse with one line and how does it work? Sorry for all the questions.

George

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J-L:

Glad to hear the horses are saving you money. I think keeping costs down is essential to running a profitable business. A lot of costs are so incremental and regular (like filling up your tractor), that some lose site of them until they realize they are making less than they should/want. I am astounded at how overcapitolized many of the traditional dairy farms are (at least around me).

Do you use 1 team/day? Seems like you have quite a few horses of different sizes as well as a couple of different sleds. How much hay are you feeding off a sled?

George

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J-L:

How common is it for farmers (ranchers?) to feed with a team of horses vs. a tractor in your area? I read an interesting article way back detailing the savings in fuel costs in feeding hay on large beef operations compared with using a tractor. This one fellow had an elaborate hydraulic boom that he used (with horses) to unload and maybe even roll out round bales.

George

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Looks great. I like your line holder up front.

George

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Like all of you, I fully support RV sponsoring these classes. It makes me crazy that the Agency of Ag is dedicating resources to this issue. One flip side to this issue that many licensed cheesemakers are concerned with illegal sales of cheese by home cheesemakers. Some in the VT cheese community (read: rumor) hypothesize that D Scruton is taking this stand (at least in part) to protect VT cheesemakers. The concern is that a home cheesemakers sells cheese that makes someone sick and that it reflects poorly on the whole cheese “industry” (of which we happen to be a part). This might seem paranoid, but it is a reality. I know of 4 familys/farms personally (that we taught to make cheese BTW) that are selling cheese and not only to friends, but at Farmer’s Market and to restaurants. I would gladly eat all of the cheese produced by these folks, but given the environment in which they are made (home kitchens which get trafficed by barn boots, etc) I do not advocate them selling it. We have battled the Agency of Ag (all the way to the legislature) on a handful of inane regs we have to follow, but the vast majority of those regs make sense for a safe product.

The health issue also bridges over to raw milk. Again, I am a firm supporter of unlimited raw milk sales by farms. With minimum sanitation, I think it is relatively easy to get clean milk when hand milking cows and goats provided you can cool your milk relatively quickly. Machine milking is a different story though. I know of one producer who uses a bucket milker that doesn’t have hot water in his milk room. He rinses with cold water after every milking and every couple of days he brings his equipment up to his house and runs boiling water through it. I am all about caveat emptor, but I am not sure the average consumer knows what questions to ask.

Does this concern equate to my supporting Agency of Ag’s stance on these classes – again, no way. As a member of RV, I would encourge the board to address the issue (I am refering to cheese sales) in some way. Kristan has done a couple of cheesemaking classes at our school to raise money for 4-H and she will continue to do so if there is a demand.

George

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Thanks for the replies. I use a “hip drop” britchen as well. Carl, great picture. You have written about horses lifting the load and the importance of strong front end as ballast. You can really see that in the picture.

George

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Donn:

Looks great. Thanks for the pictures. I gave up bullin’ (as Carl calls it) until we ge more snow melt. We have over 3′ on the ground here. What are you going to do with the ash?

George

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Ditto for us. They are a farm expense. Feed, equipment, vet, etc, etc…No issues from IRS. As long as you claim income from a business and you use your horses as part of that business, you should be all set.

George

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@john plowden 24818 wrote:

i also use full skip chain that cuts faster and takes less time to file – though will dull sooner –
John

John, can you explain how the skip chain cuts faster and dulls sooner? I thought its advantage was less sharpening. I know a lot of GOL folks are into skip chains and small bars. I’d be interested to hear how you like the skip chain compared to a regular set-up.

George

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