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George, I copy the quoted text, then click the ” in the menu above the text box, paste the text, hit return, click the ” again, then type my own reply.

 

Thanks.

 

[Does’ Leap]

Unrelated question:

Carl, how to you reply with a quote in this new system (besides copying and pasting)?

Thanks.

George

 

[Does’ Leap]

Hey Ed:

I started with a Grimm (still have it) and then purchased a Fahr (similar to Kuhn).  There is no comparison in the performance of these two tedders.  A decent pto tedder will generally cut a day off your drying time compared with a Grimm.  Moreover, if your windrows get rained on you are out of luck with a Grimm as there is no way to spread them back out to dry.  If you have a light second crop and decent weather, the Grimm will do a good job.  I have not had good luck with first cut hay.  We try to put down our first cut early as possible for dairy quality hay and the moisture in the stems is a challenge.

Your choice in tedders might also be a function of how much hay you are producing.  On a small scale (<500 bales), the investment in a pto tedder might not make a lot of sense. I bought mine for $500 which included a parts tedder.  Prior to that, the cheapest I could find was around $2000 for anything decent (i.e. somewhat field ready).

Good luck.

George

[Does’ Leap]

Thanks for the input both of you.  SH, that was an interesting article about this bit and the dynamics of it in the horse’s mouth.  Donn, to clear up the confusion on the bit history with this horse, I started driving him on a straight bar liverpool with no leverage.  I have had many struggles with this horse and ended up switching him to a jointed bit.  My wife is training him to ride in a jointed bit and he seemed more comfortable in it so I switched him early on in his training and have been using it ever since.  My main team is driven on straight bar liverpools and my mare on a jointed snaffle.

Although a liverpool bit can act as an emergency brake, what I like best about it is the differential pressure it can add to an individual horse in a team situation.  I generally drive my main team one slot down from the ring wich provides a small degree of leverage.  However, there are times when I add or subtract leverage depending the the horse’s behavior or the working situation.  Although I generally practice low pressure driving, when I am logging I like my horses more on the bit compared to general farm work.  Generally the horses adapt to the situation, but sometimes I will subtract leverage in a logging situation if I want more bit contact.  Another thing I like about the liverpool is the subtle communication it delivers compared with a non-levered bit (in my experience, of course).  If you have ever watched high level dressage, they all use levered bits (in a addition to snaffles in a two rein set-up).

For all these reasons, in addition the emergency brake, I would like to get this gelding in a liverpool.  However, I would like to make the transition as seamless as possible.  Thus the request for info on the jointed liverpool.  This is a very sensitive horse and upsets in his training require days of work to get him back to where he was.  That is why I would like to change as little as possible.

George

 

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I use Quickbooks and I like it a lot.  It can be frustrating b/c you need to be accurate to the penny.  I gave up balancing my checkbook through the program (I do that by hand) and only use the program to for invoicing, tracking expenses, and recording payments.  My wife does our taxes on Turbo Tax with all the info generated by QB.

George

[Does’ Leap]

I ran a standard 9’6″ pole (yoke to evener pin) with my halflinger and extended her heel chains b/c I was using her with larger horses.  I would guess 8’6″ would work fine.  To check it, measure from your pole strap to the middle of your trace chains (both as taught as possible) while your horse is harnessed.  A helper would be handy.  That will give you the yoke to evener measurement and then add another foot and a half (minimum) to slide and fix  the pole into the receiver on your implement.

George

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You can long chain that log to give your horses plenty of space for when the log slips down over the slope.  I use 12′ skid chains and I hook to the very end of the chain when I have situations like this.  Once your past this drop, you can back the horses and hook tight to your log.  Sometimes a 20′ chain is necessary.

 

Here is more info on this topic…http://draftanimalpower.com/forums/search/?bbp_search=logging+sustained+steep+ground

George

 

[Does’ Leap]

Yes you can used these size horses.  I have mowed hay, logged, and performed other farm tasks with a halflinger pony and an 1,100 pound draft cross (15 hands).  With a smaller team, you need to pace them accordingly and don’t overload them.  Plowing might be a little much depending on the size of the plow, the horses’ physical shape, and the amount of land you plan to turn over.  Best bet for equipment are roadsides, craigslist (put in a wanted ad), and word of mouth.

George

[Does’ Leap]

@grey 40645 wrote:

are they the same kind of clip that is often used at the hame bolt on a trace? The Aaron Martin catalog calls those “Concord Clips” : http://www.aaronmartin.com/product.php?cat_id=1230&catview=160&submit=View

Yes, that is the same clip I have used. However, where the front of the tug clips into the hame, I prefer the type of clip that has a swivel. This way the tug can move with minimal impact on the hame and collar.

@grey 40645 wrote:

How did you make the rivet holes through the foretug? I know my rotary hole punch couldn’t handle that and I don’t think even my individual strike punches could do it. Did you drill them?

I drive a 20 penny nail through the clip and tug, grind it down to within 1/4″ of the clip and peen it over – solid and easy.

George

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@grey 40636 wrote:

Ohhhhh, I seem to remember that. Did you use rivets instead of sewing?

The back of the front tug is either sewn into the D ring or it is riveted to a metal clip that goes around the D ring. If you have the clip type, you just need to grind off the rivets, cut the tug and re-set rivets. If it is sewn in, you can usually buy these clips from harness makers and repeat the aforementioned process.

George

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@grey 40622 wrote:

D-ring, no. Fore-tugs would be too long and it’s an undertaking to have them shortened.

I respectfully disagree. I have modified several d-rings (most recently for an 1100 lb Canadian and have shortened the front tugs on all my harnesses. If you have a d-ring, let me know and I will post more details on modifying the front tug.

George

[Does’ Leap]

@Donn Hewes 40570 wrote:

If you focus permitting / encourageing / developing the animals ability to relax at work, then stopping and standing will flow from that.

This has been a hard lesson for me but I think I am finally getting into my thick head. I had a preconceived notion on how I would like this Canadian to progress. He did not share that notion. He has been more than willing to fight me along the way and I have stepped up to meet him there. The result has been very little progress (in harness). I have basically started over with him and my goal is his total relaxation, my mantra is “no fighting”. I just had my first experience driving him this morning when he was 100% relaxed. I had lots of short duration, frequent stops and stayed ahead of him. I am convinced that if we continue like this, standing will come.

George

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@Carl Russell 40561 wrote:

There is another whole series of exercises that help the horse to learn that contact to me is that razor thin line between slack, and tight….

Carl:

Can you elaborate on these exercises? I have been working with my green Canadian for the past several months and it has been slow-going. Standing has been a particular challenge. Aside from frequent stops and staying ahead of your horse, what else do you do to reinforce the concept of standing/release to a new horse?

George

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John:

The weld was fine. The bolt sheared clean through. I do the same thing (head welded on the inside), except I was using 5/8. On a different but related note, instead of drilling through the end of the pole with a steel cap (and matching hole), I have gone to welding a pipe on top of the pole to receive the plug. I also size the pipe just shy of the plug. I drill the end of the plug to receive a cotter pin. Plug goes through the pipe with a cotter pin on the other side. This prevents the neck yoke for slipping off the pole when hooking up the horses. I have also made some other modifications to beef up Les’s design.

George

[Does’ Leap]

@Carl Russell 40265 wrote:

But obviously I am thinking about lifting logs. 😎

Carl

I figured that out thanks!:rolleyes: Are you thinking of a forwarder with a for your crawler with a wagon/trailer? What niche does this fill that your other logging tools don’t? I was very interested in possibly building a small forwarder to move logs long distances until I started using my scoot and bobsled to accomplish the same task. I

George

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