[Carl Russell]

Sounds like rain rot. I have never treated it with anything, just picked them off and brushed them out. Some topical antibiotic, blue coat, triple antibiotic, would probably work if they get oozy and sore, but I have never had it get that bad.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

You mean the beam across a bob-sled? Not the bunk. I wouldn’t use ash, as it rots pretty fast. I prefer sugar maple or yellow birch. They are a bit heavier, but much more rugged. The bunk takes a bit of trashing, twisting and such, and ash is softer, so bolt holes, and attachment places will get enlarged causing more loosening.

If you’re thinking about lighter duty than logging, such as a double bunk bob-sled then ash would work, but let it dry, and paint it.

If you mean the runners, ash is often a good choice because if you find a tree with a crook the grain is so consistent and in this case the flexibility is a strength. They will still rot fast, so dry, paint, and keep them off the ground.

Carl.

[Carl Russell]

I’m glad this event went so well. We were there a few years ago doing a horse-logging weekend. What a special location.

We have been in contact with many of these ox teamsters, and several of them were committed to something else, and couldn’t make it to NEAPFD this year. Any encouragement from interested parties is welcome in trying to get them to our event. There just aren’t that many working ox teamsters to choose from in order to get a few.

These types of events are made valuable when the teamsters are actually aware of the details of performing the work at hand. To many, a team is a team, and a driver, a driver, but the names mentioned above can take the discussion and demonstration to the level of practicality that makes the workshop important.

Hats off to Tim and Colin for knowing the truth about this, and working to create such a good event.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Most definitely Black Cherry. In most mature cherry trees the sap wood is only an inch or so. It is the heart wood that is sought for lumber. My experience with cherry is that the heart rot pictured here would certainly preclude use for ox-yoke blanks, and it would probably only yield about 1/3 of the volume in good usable boards. Also, cherry does often split very easily, but there can be trees that break the rule. I say burn it.

Carl
p.s. Black Locust has more distinct early/late wood cells within each growth ring, and the wood is much more black/grey/brown than the red in this tree.

[Carl Russell]

One aspect of having other people be a part of your dream is that the dream takes on a life of its own. Even though I have been living in an intuitive way for many years, I still fall into the slump where I try to evaluate where I am based on where I thought I would be, or on bad days, wish that I was.

Then I have to remember to trust the feelings that led me down this road, and try to open up again to the possibilities that are being thrust at me. The biggest obstacle to following dreams sometimes is not “seeing” the opportunities.

It is very easy, and understandable, to create a fixed image in our minds of stages and circumstances, but these can be impediments to forward motion. I know in this day and age of straight-line financial economics, and logical business planning it is nearly impossible to learn to trust intuition, “after-all a dream won’t pay the mortgage”, but in fact a dream is just that, a dream, and should be embraced as such.

I had, and have, circumstances that are different from many, but many others have circumstances that I consider more favorable than mine. I agree that part of the lifestyle that we all strive for has to be about “doing without” some of the aspects of life as we know it, but we can replace those things with other more tangible things, if we are open to seeing those changes as opportunities.

I have been both admired and despised because I am living my dream. Little do they know, it doesn’t mean that everything is peaches and cream. I still have to work hard, and make my money go as far as it can, and deal with the let-downs that come from poor weather, or poor planning, or both.

Remember it is a personal choice. How you go about it is up to you. You are the only one that needs to enjoy yourself. Don’t get impatient. Stay open, and let it be your dream.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

I think you’ll have to give us more to go on, like a picture, color of the heart-wood, bark characteristics,etc… Then I’d be glad to take a guess, Carl

[Carl Russell]

Robert MoonShadow;12307 wrote:

…. what is “TSI”?

This is a definition from the index of terminology that I include in my forestry management plans.

Forest Improvement : Processes to improve the forest’s ability to meet long range objectives. T.S.I., or timber stand improvement typically is non-commercial thinning to remove low quality and poorly performing trees, improving the potential for growth of the best trees. Crop Tree Release is the practice of selecting the trees with the highest potential to meet long range objectives, and releasing them by removing direct competition. This can be done by harvest, or non-commercially by means of girdling, or cleaning and weeding by cutting unwanted stems.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

You may want to have her teeth checked, or evaluate the bit, as it may be giving her pain. This can often lead the increased fighting behavior.

Working alone will also be good for her, as I have found horses often display this behavior as a result of the dynamic between the two animals. This horse may be disturbed by the other horse’s behavior, and working her alone will help her to focus on you and not the other horse.

Also remember not to “hold” her back. She needs to realize that she can walk without significant line pressure, and as long as you are keeping the pressure on she will not feel reward for slowing down, all she’ll feel is the pain of the bit constantly.

Pulse on the lines, or pull hard to get her to slow her pace, then allow her to walk freely. As soon as she picks up the pace put on the pressure again, but in pulses, because if she gets ahold of the bit she will just fight against you again.

Pulse, pulse, possibly a slight sawing to help prevent her from turning her head, but this way she will feel the bit pressure, and not constant pain. She will also feel the release of pressure, as long as her teeth or the bit are not causing pain.

When she learns to equate the release of pressure with the speed of her gait then she will eventually learn that it is much more comfortable for her to walk then to keep speeding up. It will help speed this up for you if you are pulling some weight like disc harrows on a couple of acres.

This is really a confidence issue for her. She needs to believe that she can walk comfortably when hitched. There is something that is causing her to become nervous, possibly body language from the other horse, possibly she gets tired too easily and is trying extra hard, possibly her mouth is in pain and she is trying to eliminate it by fighting.

I know from personal experience that this behavior can be very frustrating, but if you can maintain a sense of humility so that when she gives just the least indication that she is getting the picture, then you can reward her by speaking calmly to her, “easy”, or even when she begins to walk comfortably, stop and give her a rest. These things will go a long way toward success.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

We have had our farm in the program for many years. I can’t say that being a certified tree farm has had any real benefit to us. It’s just a way to validate that you are doing some good things on your farm. The truth is that you are probably doing many more interesting and wonderful things on your piece than most of the other Tree Farmers. The program is heavily tilted toward conventional forestry, but I still have a sign on the barn.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Very Cool. You give Pirates a good name. Now this is the “Moonshadow Wisdom” to which I referred.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

I agree with Jason. It will be more divisive if we include such a statement because then we will have to define it, and adhere to that definition. Having bunched for skidders, crawlers, forwarders, and even skidded from a crawler bunching for me, I can appreciate the intent of the statement.

I think if we concentrate on the crux of our effort, Draft Animal Powered Forestry, then we will have our greatest effect. I can see that somehow encouraging the development of certain types of equipment that may be more facilitative to the use of animals, ie walking beam arches, or multi-purpose skidding tools, might be close to that objective, but the lines are murky when we try to define what is truely “appropriate”.

Just so you all know, I have never owned a tractor or other such conveyance. I have logged with bob-sled, scoot, and forecart, almost exclusively, and I have stacked hundreds of thousands of board feet, and hundreds of cords, by hand. For me the choice was not as much “appropriateness” due to the relationship to working animals, as much as my own personal financial calculation. (I’ll also say that I thrive on significant physical exertion)

So anyway my point is that what is “appropriate” to me may be ludicrous to another. I think we should collect the mission of this group to not be about who is in because of how they do what they do, but rather how we all can be in because of a few core deatils that bind us all together.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Great to have you in board, Carl

[Carl Russell]

tsigmon;12248 wrote:

I am serious… what difference does it make so long as the job gets done.?

The difference that I see is a matter of consistent efficient and comfortable use of the working animal.

In my mind it is important to realize that as animals move they must reflexively employ a lifting motion. Watch them lift their head with every step of a hind foot. When applying their power to the movement of weight, we should remember the innate mechanical action that is the underpinning working the animal.

When the hitch is low the animal will be able to use the involuntary muscle action that is hardwired into it. As the hitch point is raised then the animal has to use more forward power, limiting its effort more toward using its body weight as ballast, rather than being able to use muscle. They have much smaller muscles for pushing their weight back down then they do for lifting it up.

Long legged horses were used on delivery wagons not because of flashy action, but so that the animals could still have “lift” over the load so that they could maintain efficient motion.

The natural motion of four-legged animals is up-out-down, and this is fundamental to employing them to perform work. (At least as far as I see it:))

Carl

[Carl Russell]

I never said there wasn’t a forward motion, only that the primary action for the animal is lift. The working animal cannot move forward without lifting. Even at a leisurely walk there is lifting action.

The primary power on comes over the hind quarters and is translated in the extension of the distance between the hind feet and the shoulder, which pushes the front part of the body upward before it goes forward. Because the front of the body is where most of the weight is, animals need to add lift from the hind quarters so that they can move their front feet without falling down. (This is the same translation of power that allows us to hold our torsos straight up as we walk)

If we used the push only, then we would be hitching to the draft point and drawing a horizontal line back to the load. Having had the misfortune of trying a few loads like this in weird circumstances, I can tell you “pushing” is not an effective use of animal power.

I only mention this (again:)) because “pushing” is an over-simplification of the power action of the working animal per the original post by Bumpus. I will settle for “lift-push”, but “pushing” misses the point when used alone.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Equines lift their front end off the ground as they move forward, and cattle lift the load with their necks as they move forward. The power in draft animals comes from lift. If they could stand on their hinds then the “lift” might be only vertical, but they can’t and lift is part of their natural forward motion.

Of course with high wheeled vehicles the power is then turned closer to a push, but the active power that animals use to move a weight forward is lift, that is why the angle of draft goes downward from the shoulder toward the heel.

There is no doubt that the forward motion can be considered a “push”, but it is a push upward.

Carl

[Author]

Posts