[Carl Russell]

An elbow held outward from the body, either in the ribs or the flank is all I have ever needed. The point being find the point on the horse where they will flinch, and show them that if they push into you, they will cause themselves discomfort. It usually takes very few applications.

I rarely raise my voice in this case. Just cause the pain/discomfort and steadily calmly tell the horse to step over. Release the pressure as soon as they let off, but be right there in case they aren’t sure exactly what you mean.

Sometimes I may grit my teeth and speak with a bit more meaning, but I don’t want the horse to think I am threatened in any way, and I don’t want the horse to step over because they are afraid of leaning into me. I just want them to know that I don’t want them leaning on me, that I want them to step away from me, and that if they don’t they will be uncomfortable until they do.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Jason’s post got me thinking (his posts often do).

Although I do appreciate the recognition, my celebrity, if it is that at all, is the result of encouragement and mentoring of at least a dozen men and women. So when I am credited with something worth saying it is often the voices of those people coming through.

I know that there are some of us who by some stroke have decided to speak up, or step up, at a particularly auspicious time, and because of that we may have become more recognizable than some others. But I still find my greatest reward deep in the woods, by myself, working out some difficult situation with my animals.

I have my heroes too. Some are very well known, but many more are not so well known. I really try to keep those people in my mind while I have the opportunity to hold the speaking stick.

It doesn’t feel that long ago that I was just focused on the trail in front of me, and spent most of my time gathering information and gaining skills, with little interest in how I might help, or affect others. But like so many others in this community of interest, I went through the metamorphosis to where I had something to offer, and slowly began reaching out.

We spend a lot of time on this site, and throughout this network, talking about horsemanship, equipment, techniques, and methods of farming and logging, but there also is a significant component of this interaction that has to do with mentoring, advising, and encouraging others to continue.

So, perhaps some of us have become “Celebrities”, but we are only holding that chair for you…. for when you’ve gotten your feet under you, and gained the fluency to become affective in your own right. Then we expect that you will also reach out to others, and through that you will become recognized for your own effort.

Thank you in advance for all your hard work;), Carl

[Carl Russell]

There is a family near me that actually has bulbs in every outlet, but when they are milking they start at one end of the barn and with one light on, all the rest turned out. Then as they work their way down the barn, they screw the next one in and the last one out. They have done it this way for years. They have no need to light the whole barn…. so they don’t.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Here is the link to Eastern CT Draft Horse Assoc. http://www.easternCTdrafthorse.com

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Scott, are you thinking of individual operations, or as a community marketing initiative?

Carl

[Carl Russell]

That’s Sam. He is very approachable, and I’m sure he would be a great resource for you. He does just about anything a person can do with horses, and he is a very good teamster.

Elaine and Terry are also very well connected, and would be good resource as well.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

When our daughter was 5 years old she named her gilt Brittany Spears. She never settled when we bred her, so we ate her……. that’s as close as I have ever come.

Matthew, welcome. Do you know Elaine Kealey, Northeastern Connecticut Draft Horse Association? Sam Rich, in Abington? Definitely look them up. That Sam, he is a real celebrity among the best plowmen in the US. If you need their contacts let me know.

Thanks for the enthusiastic comments. Hope to see more from you, Carl

[Carl Russell]

Donn this is a good topic. The day you posted this I had two conversations with different people about this very aspect of being a teamster.

One of the things that I have learned is how horses can tell when you are not in control of your emotions. This is important to them, as this indicates that you are a questionable leader.

That is not to say that they won’t react to a display of “BIG” energy, like an outburst, or forceful frustration, because it is uncomfortable for them. The more important thing is whether they see that you can regain your composure and refocus on your own initiative. And whether you are respectful of their desire to remain calm.

I remember early on when I would blow up because “the GD horse didn’t know what the F… they were doing”, how the animal would sort of recoil, raise his head, and with wide eyes just sort of look at me. I didn’t realize at the time that I should be clear headed enough to take advantage of that moment, because I had the horse’s attention. Rather I would continue to rant and rave, and the horse and I would end up doing this futile dance until I was exhausted, something broke, or by some fluke things would work out.

At some point I came across a video in which a trainer was methodically elevating his energy, and then as soon as the horse did the big eye thing, the trainer would immediately lower his energy, regaining a calm posture. And the horse was glued to him. When I tried this I was floored…..and not only did I learned a lot about horses, but really I began to learn about myself.

When I am working around my animals now, I am constantly watching them to see how they are reacting to the way I conduct myself. If they are indifferent, or ignore me, or are distracted, then I start to increase my energy. I move quicker. I don’t give them as much room, or rest, until they show me that I have gotten their attention, then I “lay on the butter”. I smooth right out.

They are very attracted to the calm behavior, but I think it is more than that. I have seen very calm quiet, almost meek, people try to work around horses, and they invariably get taken advantage of. My sense is that it has more to do with the demonstration of control, as well as the demonstration that I know how much they enjoy the calmness.

In other words I can turn my behavior into the language I use with them. When they are doing just what I want, then I am purposefully demonstrating my approval with calmness. I am not perfect, but blowing up is no longer part of my language.

I can bark, or push, or become physically tense, but I know now how these expressions affect the animals, and I am prepared to immediately regain my composure…in fact I actually can remain composed and still use them…on the surface moving out of the calm space, but underneath I am purposeful and looking for the desired response.

It is an interesting exercise to fake frustration. Stand in front of the horse and tense up. Clench your jaw, and allow the blood to come to your face. Even shake, as if you are about to blow a gasket. The horse will definitely notice, and it is a great exercise in learning how to take control of your physical expressions by then relaxing and letting all of that tension leave your body.

In all of this I have learned to just let the horse be the horse. I think I have learned about how they read me, and I think I have learned about myself. I have adapted, so that my behavior is no longer a semi-conscious reflex reaction, but a purposeful expression of intent.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

In Vermont there is a Mapping Program (agency) that has the entire state on Orthophotos. These are areal photos that have been digitized to correct the differences in landscape so that they can be used as two dimensional maps. Every town in the state has tax maps, with parcels drawn to scale to overlay these Orthophotos. NH has property tax, right? I am surprised the County Forester didn’t tell you where to find these resources. If you google Orthophotographs NH you should get a bead on them. This will get you hard copy….but as Tim said the GIS software is expensive, and there may be a forester in your local that has it.

Anyway, I use the Orthophotos for VT in combination with the town tax maps to get boundary location. I use tracing paper to get stand delineation.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

This is all starting to take shape for me.

It would definitely require more strategic planning and outreach, but rather than having members that are paying dues all the time, have members that are interested in supporting and knowing about the opportunities. Possibly a nominal fee to be on the contact list to cover expenses???

I haven’t quite gotten to the place where I can wrap my head around the non-tangible eco-tourism part. I kind of like my privacy, although we have people coming around here all the time anyway. It’s definitely worth more thought. I mean I totally get the value, I just can’t see how I would want to market it/them. I suppose for the base membership people could be given an open invitation to use our skid trails for XC Skiing, or snowshoeing, or to come by and help out with chores, milking weeding etc.
I can see combining some of the farm products with all of this too.

I like the idea of having a core product like fuelwood, that I can produce daily, that can be taken right to the finished product regardless of whether there are any orders. I could pre-sell to enough customers for say 30-50 cords, and use that as the income base for the CSF. Then as I see myself getting into the hemlock in a month or so, I could advertise for orders.

Erik, how did you amass your master list? Was that from visits at farmers markets? Or some other manner? I could definitely see us all using this site to some degree, and we have a blog, and there’s facebook etc.., but I hadn’t really thought about that type of membership/outreach process. I can see that working.

It’s funny how long I’ve kicked these ideas around in my own head, but all I needed was to get a few other points of view. I tend to spend too much time in my own little world…..but they all know me here:eek:. There is definitely a rush of new thoughts.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

Oh, how much do I need to know about flour:p.

This is a reasonably good idea on the surface, but what if I don’t have white oak logs at the mill, or I have lots of hemlock, but not the lengths they are looking for, and the logs are on the deck, or taking up room in the yard? I can’t keep lumber around for ever either waiting to be cut into desirable products.

This is the whole inventory problem. Got to have enough to respond, but can’t have too much just sitting around waiting for a customer. If they are on the stump, then I can custom cut to order, but then here comes the time factor, which is not a problem for the right customer, but it narrows the market.

I don’t mean to just offer obstacles, it’s just working out these details can be difficult.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

There are two aspects to this.

One is the exposure/challenge that is both educational and instructive, both for the people performing the course, and for those watching.

The other, is the opportunity for folks to have enjoyment challenging themselves and their teams to take on a series of obstacles.

I like the idea of a working obstacle course. I see no point in competitions for competition sake, but I think that most of the people I associate with in this community of interest are pretty comfortable and could handle a friendly competition.

I would love to see an obstacle course that actually was enacted in the woods. Each person drew a number for a tree. Each tree, or perhaps section would have certain criterion to the fell. Felling, processing, skidding to a landing with sawmill or log loader working there, using sleds, or perhaps carts. This could highlight not only the individual’s skills, but the skills themselves, as well as the performance of the equipment and how to use it, and even portraying the different potential distractions and threatening situations that can occur.

One of the reasons why staging these things in the open, fairgrounds, fields, is that there is more room for people to witness them safely.

We have stayed away from “entertainment” at NEAPFD for much the same reason that Jason R. mentioned, but I have come close, considering the positives, not to mention that people, in and out of this community, love to watch. Perhaps 2010 is the year????

Carl

[Carl Russell]

I like Erik’s format. I have thought of something similar for firewood, but the problem tends to be in marketing, as people don’t have regular needs for forest products the way they do for bread or tomatoes.

My idea actually rotated around fuelwood, because I have so much low grade on the property. I also have a sawmill, but mostly I just take custom orders when someone wants some logs sawed.

I am trying to put together a system for folks to actually come and work in my woodlot, or on the landing as a way to offset the cost of their wood, saving me labor, and helping to provide me with inventory that I can either sell, or use myself.

I have been selling forest products into my community direct from the farm for years, and I have found that most people have periodic or one-time needs. I’m sure that I could improve this with a little more work, but it still feels more like marketing on per-job basis, and not really CSF.

Another idea that has crossed my mind would have to do with an association of landowners, linked by a shared forestry consultant, or harvester, to cooperatively amass their resources to be marketed through the use of a local sawmill. The problem is overcoming the centralized lumber marketing industry. It is very hard to get anyone other than the small-scale niche timber-framer to really look for any volume of local material, when they can just get the lumber yard to deliver 100 sticks any day of the week.

I generally need at least 6 weeks, and preferably 8 to get together an order of any size, and considering weather, kids, farm etc.., it could be more than that, especially if the order is complex. It has proven to be a damper on cultivating business.

I sawed out the frame for a small 16×24 timber-frame shed last summer. It was assembled by a local builder, and raffled off for a fundraiser. I was appalled at how hard it was to convince people that a $10 ticket was a good deal. And even though I used the opportunity to get my name out there, I haven’t gotten any more interest than was already there.

One of the differences with even the model that Erik uses is that our inventory is either still on the stump, or in round wood, but if it is already sawed then we already have a lot invested, and we need even more to respond to the custom order. At least with flour, even though there is a lot of investment in making it, there is a much faster turn-around from flour to the wide variety of marketable items. I am kind of stumped;) on how to turn this model from the sell from inventory model, to the CSF model.

I am loathe to spend much money on advertising, or marketing. My products already require a substantial investment to produce. At least I can produce with minimal outlay of cash, owning the land, timber, and harvesting and processing equipment, and the skills and knowledge to go along with it. Spending cash on marketing/advertising just seems hard to justify.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

I put my thumb ON the point of the shoulder, and reach up with my little finger extended. If I can just reach the trace it is in the right place. This is a rough estimate rule of thumb. The main thing is that the trace/hame/collar should be high enough so that the load sets the collar back into the appropriate place.

Carl

[Carl Russell]

goodcompanion;14243 wrote:

Carl,

Of course I know you and NEAPFD are on board and I hesitated to even get into this line of discussion. It’s not my wish to undermine anybody’s good ideas or well-intentioned efforts (particularly yours, and this is your board, after all) while there is any hope alive of them working. Particularly with the notion of on-farm education I do think there is a role to fill and potential for resounding success.

But taking a community of interest from the realm of ideas to the realm of action is where the rubber meets the road. I am not sure that the SFJ community is ready for this transition. I am apprehensive about the scope as I understand it.

I guess I understand what SFJ is and what its role is in my life, I understand what DAP is, I understand what NEAPFD is and value them all. Probably when the SFC takes on a definable shape I will be a staunch supporter, but right now I don’t understand what role it proposes to play in my life very well at all. I am also a recovering former Quaker and have a lot of difficulty with group efforts that are idealistic, ambitious and open-ended.

I agree with all of this, as I said before. I also wonder how SFC will affect me and mine particularly since I have spent most of my adult life trying to address these very concerns myself….And I am not alone in this community of interest.

And I don’t think critical analysis is an act of undermining. That is how I became involved. I don’t tend to just jump on a band wagon. I like an intellectual interaction. I really don’t see SFC going anywhere as a Titanic, carrying everybody to safety(oops maybe that was a better analogy for Erik). It will have to be an “IDEA” that take shape in actions by people who want to move it forward at the individual and local level.

I’m glad to have this discussion here…and I don’t see it over yet.

I have no excuse, just taken by language at an early age, and I love to practice. Thanks for humoring me.

Carl

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