[Baystatetom]

Nice hitches, I can’t wait until mine can pull more then a log at a time. I have been pulling hemlock logs every weekend now and am completely addicted to working my team in the woods. So many little challenges make it interesting.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

I work mine pretty hard. I am careful not to hook them to anything I am not positive they can pull, but on the other hand I want them to be used to pulling hard. When they are full grown I want them to give me 110% on big hardwood logs, therefore I think they need to get used to the idea now. I like to keep it to around half their weight for longer workouts but don’t mind if the load equals their weight for short distances. My team is just shy of two years old and are a bit over 1000 pounds each. Some of the logs I have been pulling are probably getting close to the 1000 pound mark but coming through the woods with dips and divots and the end of the logs digging in it is pretty hard work. If I pull a big butt log I’ll take a short tip log right after so they don’t get discouraged always being freighted down. I keep the secessions short and reward them for a job well done with lots of praise and chin scratching. I’ll tackle almost any job with them that you would with a mature team, I just do it for a much shorter length of time.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

It seams this discussion has bounced all over, so I will through in a another conversation as well. Other then saving wear on the runners is there any pros or cons to having a steel shod scoot. Does it drag easier with steel? I have the steel parts for several old sleds/scoots and have had rebuilding them on my to do list for a while now. Now that my team is getting big enough to pull one it is getting closer to the top of the list. Seams like they used to use cast iron on the runners, or at least that is what I am guessing the old ones I have drug out of the woods are. My grandfathers old scoot hanging from the rafters of the old equipment shed appears to be too dry rotted to use. I am thinking of using it as a template and steeling all the hardware off it. However it is not steel shod.
Any advice is greatly appreciated
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

Just a little sore today, not bad at all. Probably pulled a mussel, just not a flexible as I used to be.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

Good thinking, I would like to be that organized someday.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

I have a sled I built to carry stuff around. Nothing fancy at all 2X10″ steel shod runners with a wood deck between.
Made entirely out of scraps. Only spent an afternoon on it but It has lasted 3 years now. Anyhow I put a pole on it
Similar to how Rod has described during sugar season to help hold it back, and it did indeed try to pass the team on slopes.
Worked great on flat ground or very slight inclines but on even moderate slopes it was a problem. If I use it like that again
I think I’ll put a chain from the pole to the runner on either side to keep it straighter. When I put it on there I thought
it would be better for turning because I could move the team around without skidding the sled, that way the outside
steer wouldn’t have to skid the sled around himself on the corners. (working in snow with a young team) At the time I
was wishing all the old timers I knew had not died on me, they could have told me how to do it right the first time!
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

Where are you? The needles look like eastern white pine and the bark looks more like pitch pine. I am guessing it is neither, and you have a different type of pines then I do. If I knew where you are, I or somebody else on here could narrow the possibilities.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

One of the beagle clubs I manage timber for is always blaming owls for killing their snowshoe hares. They often find them missing their heads and otherwise untouched. A wildlife biologist told me he could never figure out how it is that, that became known as a owl trait. How would a bird like a owl or hawk with a toothless beak chew up a skull? This biologist says that is most definitely a weasel of some sort, mink, long tailed weasel, or fisher in the case of the hare. Can’t say I really know myself but I do think this biologist is pretty darn good at what he does and I would have to think he knows what he is talking about.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

Skidder was mudded out today, wish it wasn’t a uphill skid I would have brought the bulls.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

I hate arguing silviculture with other foresters but here I go anyway. To me forestry is more an art then a science. I take or leave trees based on the exact situation and therefore a formula for how many dead snags per acre or trying to remove or retain an exact basal area makes no sense at all. I realize there has to be someway of explaining what we are doing but all the numbers and formulas just don’t work their way through my thick head. If you want “woodpecker trees” I would girdle trees with little or no timber value or potential for improvement, the number per acre would depend on the quality of the trees.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

I would like to think I am more experienced with a a chainsaw and/or real world application of forestry then most Consulting Foresters, however I would never mean to imply that I am a expert chopper. Every logger I work with is way better then me. I am just happy to have had the last couple of winters with a good logger who can keep an eye on me.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

The low grade thing is something I have wrestled with for a long time in my head. I hope my background as a consulting forester will be a asset. If a lot is not well suited for draft animals due to topography, $ constraints, or skid length, I’ll just put it to bid for the machine guys like I always have. On the other hand over the past 15 years I have done a lot of improvement cuts, those properties should be looking pretty good now. I also have a chase circular mill that I am putting together. It will produce at least double the production of one of those portable band mills. I hope to be a supplier of rough sawn lumber for my community. Turning that hemlock and pine into boards and 2Xs should ad value to my product. To bad green certification doesn’t work for the little guy.
One more year, the steers will be bigger and stronger, and the mill will be fully operational.
~Tom
And yeah Rick I worry some trees will be to big here as well. I have seen some red oak pushing 30″ DBH, a 12′ log off them has got to be heavy. Steel shod sled in the winter I guess.

[Baystatetom]

I started chopping on a project today. 8 acre wildlife clearing in a hardwood stand. I am leaving all the nice oak (not many of them maybe 10/acre) and taking everything else. I am guessing it is about a 1000′ skid. I have a friend there with his mid 70s 440A, he takes 7 firewood trees at a time. The log pile looked like a heavy load on a triaxle after a 7 hour day. That’s worth $700 down here now. After we take out expenses I am still pretty happy that, not to mention a few decent birch and ash sawlogs in my sites for first thing in the morning. As we work the skid will get shorter, and the hole to drop trees in bigger. Our production should go up.
My whole point when I started this ramble is we did well with two guys, if you put in another chopper and twitcher we would have had to produce two loads. Would you be just as well off to be slow and not split the profit so many times? If I can keep up with a skidder alone I should be able to bury a horse. I do spend a above average time lopping up tops real small, but maybe not enough to offset the time of limbing spruce/fir compared to soft maple and black birch. The clear cut definitely makes it faster too, once I have a hole its easier then being selective or thinning for sure.
I’m thinking of tackling lots with a few main skid trails to be used with a 4×4 tractor and bunching logs along those trails with my steers. I’ll chop a few hours bunch a few etc. Then I’ll give the team a rest for a day and run the logs all out to the landing with the tractor. Yes, No, Maybe?
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

I agree Rick. It will be hard to find landowners willing to sell hemlock and beech at a loss. In this case it is timber off my land that I am going to saw into boards for my own use so it actually saves me money. I am hoping within a year to leave my full time job and go to work for my self. I will continue to act as a consulting forester, and also run my sawmill along with working the steers in the woods. I have a large client base and am well known in my area so I just have to be fussy about the jobs I will take. If a lot isn’t well suited for working with animals I will mark it and put it out to bid. Like it or not draft power in the woods is still a niche. I am placing a bet that there is a big enough niche in my area to keep me busy. I think folks are willing to be green within reason. A lot of folks will take less money or maybe even pay a little out, in order to do the right thing. As long as the $ and numbers are not way to far out of line, I think it will work. I also really see the value of a hybrid system. Working a team along with a machine could really boost production and help lessen the $ gap. Carl really helped me to realize it is just a mental thing. You have to think of your self as providing a service and not as a production logger.
~Tom

[Baystatetom]

O yeah see that puddle in front of them, they went around it.
~Tom

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